Author Topic: Good news for people on Fuerteventura  (Read 1284 times)

Offline dagwood

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Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« on: August 23, 2018, 08:19:13 am »
Good news for people on Fuerteventura
Agreement has been reached in talks between Ryanair and pilots' union Fórsa, the trade union has said.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #1 on: August 23, 2018, 08:51:43 am »
Let’s keep the good news for all of Europe and beyond going.

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #2 on: August 23, 2018, 10:21:45 am »
Let’s keep the good news for all of Europe and beyond going.

Well the agreement has been agreed with the union officials it stlll is going to a ballot with the workforce, plus the Ryanair board has to meet to sanction it.

Last month, cabin crew from Spain, Portugal and Belgium walked out for two days, grounding 600 flights. The airline still faces a wide range of grievances from workers across Europe over pay and conditions.

Payments for strike action are still not recognised by Ryanair as their responsibility so do not automatically pay compensation, as insist the stoppages are beyond its control and says that claims will be refused.

So still some hurdles for RA to jump through to see clear skies.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #3 on: August 23, 2018, 10:25:57 am »
So good news is not good news. Your glass must be always half empty.
 But then of course your an economist.
I’m sure the pilots will take action to see the passengers get compo.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 10:29:59 am by dagwood »

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #4 on: August 23, 2018, 11:48:12 am »
So good news is not good news. Your glass must be always half empty.
 But then of course your an economist.
I’m sure the pilots will take action to see the passengers get compo.

I didn`t make any statement about whether it was good news or bad. Just pointed out the facts that the issues around RA are still there. So people who want to fly with RA which includes myself if the price and the chance of the flight actually flying and not being cancelled, can make arrangements either with RA or another airline in the near future.

Personally for me I`m still making alternative arrangements when I fly staying away from RA as having an airline who doesn`t cancel flights due to a number of circumstances (whoever is to blame) is more important to me. However I know that for many others they will make different judgments according to how they feel about what will happen. So surely you would agree that everyone should have the full details of events or were any of the points I made wrong, if so I would be happy if you could correct the facts so I can make a more informed decision and perhaps change my opinion about whether I should choose RA in the near future.

Offline bedouin

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #5 on: August 23, 2018, 12:06:14 pm »
Easyjet has a habit of cancelling flights.  Despite being a much smaller airline than Ryanair, Easyjet cancelled 1263 flights in June, compared with 1100 flights cancelled by Ryanair.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #6 on: August 23, 2018, 12:48:17 pm »
So good news is not good news. Your glass must be always half empty.
 But then of course your an economist.
I’m sure the pilots will take action to see the passengers get compo.

I didn`t make any statement about whether it was good news or bad. Just pointed out the facts that the issues around RA are still there. So people who want to fly with RA which includes myself if the price and the chance of the flight actually flying and not being cancelled, can make arrangements either with RA or another airline in the near future.

Personally for me I`m still making alternative arrangements when I fly staying away from RA as having an airline who doesn`t cancel flights due to a number of circumstances (whoever is to blame) is more important to me. However I know that for many others they will make different judgments according to how they feel about what will happen. So surely you would agree that everyone should have the full details of events or were any of the points I made wrong, if so I would be happy if you could correct the facts so I can make a more informed decision and perhaps change my opinion about whether I should choose RA in the near future.



Definitely your choice, and as we know all airlines have cancellations and naturally when your the biggest you may have more flight to keep control of. I wonder if we were to look at other airlines what proportion of their flights are cancelled and proportionally how does this stack up, and how many of them don’t cancel but just put up a delayed notice.
I spoke to someone last who spent 24 hours getting home from Portugal with TUi.
Well that flight wasn’t cancelled but if it was Ryanair it would be and replace with a new flight number.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 12:51:51 pm by dagwood »

Offline Lexeus

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #7 on: August 23, 2018, 13:15:30 pm »
Easyjet has a habit of cancelling flights.  Despite being a much smaller airline than Ryanair, Easyjet cancelled 1263 flights in June, compared with 1100 flights cancelled by Ryanair.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing:

"Strikes, air traffic control restrictions and bad weather forced easyJet to cancel 1,263 flights in June.

This compared with 213 cancellations experienced in the same month last year.

“Around 900 were due to French and Italian industrial action with a further 150 arising from ATC restrictions and adverse weather conditions,” the UK budget carrier said."

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articles/307167/easyjet-cancelled-1263-flights-in-june

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/italy-strikes-flights-storms-cancellations-chaos-union-a8388821.html
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 13:18:43 pm by Lexeus »

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #8 on: August 23, 2018, 13:52:47 pm »
Easyjet has a habit of cancelling flights.  Despite being a much smaller airline than Ryanair, Easyjet cancelled 1263 flights in June, compared with 1100 flights cancelled by Ryanair.

A little knowledge is a dangerous thing:

"Strikes, air traffic control restrictions and bad weather forced easyJet to cancel 1,263 flights in June.

This compared with 213 cancellations experienced in the same month last year.

“Around 900 were due to French and Italian industrial action with a further 150 arising from ATC restrictions and adverse weather conditions,” the UK budget carrier said."

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articles/307167/easyjet-cancelled-1263-flights-in-june

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/italy-strikes-flights-storms-cancellations-chaos-union-a8388821.html

Thank you  Lexeus for pointing out that fact for bedouin. We are all aware that every airline has cancellations due to weather, technical and ATC strikes and sometimes other factors outside their control which no airline can control. While some airlines may be able to divert planes due to planes now being used at high flight capacity and W patterns etc even the biggest can not guarantee an alternative flight with either themselves or other airlines.

All we can do is judge which airline has the greatest chance of getting you from A to B. They will all be affected by the considerations I mentioned above, but some posters seem to be blind to rational thought and take it personal if anyone points out that RA are at the moment a greater risk of cancelling flights due to the present issues it is having with its workforce.

Perhaps they have an agenda about other issues which cloud their judgement on everything else. All companies over a period of time have to change their company structure as time go by whether they are successful or not and have to address issues within the corporate structure to ensure not only success but their own existence. RA are under pressure to change from a cheap workforce with low fares, they have a decision to make whether to keep to this structure or change other policies. It is that battle with the workforce which we are seeing now. As a passenger its not my concern unless I book with them at the moment, so I look for alternatives until the matter is resolved completely.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 13:55:28 pm by beachlife »

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #9 on: August 23, 2018, 14:11:52 pm »
Let me put it this way, if a flights cancelled its for a reason and its normally something to do with safety, let there be no traffic controllers bad weather or an issue with the plane.  Don't forget the sun could be shining where you leaving from and storms where your going. Also look a Gatwick's total failure last week, you cant blame the Airline for that. So if you were leaving Fuerteventura and heading home to Gatwick which is closed because of a computer breakdown and no time scale for the repair you will have a major problem and no point in blaming the Airline and they probably wont have much information either.       
Now I don't know about you people but in all those situations I would prefer to have my feet on the ground. 
Industrial action in an airline well most carriers have had their share at one time or another.
There were a lot of people left sitting on their butts all over Europe when various airlines went belly up over the last number of years, one of the most recent was a favourite with the posters on here, Monarch. Now who's next I wonder but I bet its not Ryanair or EazyJet.       
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 14:20:54 pm by dagwood »

Offline vivafuerte

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #10 on: August 23, 2018, 14:50:41 pm »
some posters seem to be blind to rational thought and take it personal


shareholders, by law need to announce they are holding shares if they promote a share.


Offline bedouin

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #11 on: August 23, 2018, 14:59:24 pm »


A little knowledge is a dangerous thing:

"Strikes, air traffic control restrictions and bad weather forced easyJet to cancel 1,263 flights in June.

This compared with 213 cancellations experienced in the same month last year.

“Around 900 were due to French and Italian industrial action with a further 150 arising from ATC restrictions and adverse weather conditions,” the UK budget carrier said."

http://www.travelweekly.co.uk/articles/307167/easyjet-cancelled-1263-flights-in-june

https://www.independent.co.uk/travel/news-and-advice/italy-strikes-flights-storms-cancellations-chaos-union-a8388821.html

It is indeed dangerous!  So Easyjet only had 213 cancelled flights in June 2017, did they?  Interestingly, Ryanair only cancelled 41 flights in June 2017.  You need to check your facts before posting!


Offline bedouin

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #12 on: August 23, 2018, 15:01:37 pm »


shareholders, by law need to announce they are holding shares if they promote a share.

Nobody has suggested buying Ryanair shares.  In any case, it's probably true that many people unwittingly hold Ryanair shares through various pension funds.

Offline Johnrgby2

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #13 on: August 23, 2018, 15:31:40 pm »


shareholders, by law need to announce they are holding shares if they promote a share.

Nobody has suggested buying Ryanair shares.  In any case, it's probably true that many people unwittingly hold Ryanair shares through various pension funds.

As I have just said on another thread, I am no fan of Dire Air, but you are absolutely correct bedouin, many people do, us included, but we are not about to say no to the input they make to our pension fund.

Offline Lexeus

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #14 on: August 23, 2018, 16:36:35 pm »
I personally don't think Ryanair were ever a very reliable airline if you really needed to try and guarantee a flight was going to be problem-free, but personally that isn't the main reason that I never buy a ryanair ticket if I can help it. For me it''s the attitude of o'leary that makes me avoid them at all costs, when he said he wanted to charge for the toilets I think it really gives you an insight into his frame of mind. He may try and pass it off with the corporate message of " ... if you get rid of two [toilets] you can get six seats on a 737" but essentially what I hear is "...why are our battery hens being given creature comforts, they squeeze out money either way"

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2009/jun/02/ryanair-airline-oleary-toilet-charge


By the way, the only ryanair flight I have ever taken was delayed by 2 hours because they had a shortage of staff and just couldn't process everyone to get on the aeroplane in time. It was the day I flew 4 flights in a single day, 2 with egyptair, 1 with vueling, 1 with ryanair, and thankgod the ryanair one was the final flight.... and the only one that wasn't early or atleast on time ;)
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 16:38:58 pm by Lexeus »

Offline vivafuerte

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2018, 16:48:13 pm »
the last time I flew ryannair I got flea bites all over my legs.

i will never fly with them again.

Offline bedouin

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2018, 17:11:46 pm »
I personally don't think Ryanair were ever a very reliable airline if you really needed to try and guarantee a flight was going to be problem-free, but personally that isn't the main reason that I never buy a ryanair ticket if I can help it. For me it''s the attitude of o'leary that makes me avoid them at all costs, when he said he wanted to charge for the toilets I think it really gives you an insight into his frame of mind. He may try and pass it off with the corporate message of " ... if you get rid of two [toilets] you can get six seats on a 737" but essentially what I hear is "...why are our battery hens being given creature comforts, they squeeze out money either way"


Michael O'Leary has very successfully promoted the airline (at virtually no cost) by issuing frequent headline-grabbing comments, usually somewhat tongue-in-cheek.  You remember the coin slot on the toilet threat.  Remember the proposal to have standing-up passengers at the back of the plane?  Or that the best way to settle their differences with Dublin Airport would be "with Semtex"?  Or describing Aer Lingus's pilots as "overpaid, underworked peacocks"?   Or saying "easyJet are not the brightest sandwiches in the picnic basket"?  Or his view on transatlantic flights - "Ryanair will never fly the Atlantic route because one cannot get there in a Boeing 737, unless one has a very strong tail wind or passengers who can swim the last hour of the flight"?  All a bit of fun, all guaranteed to get Ryanair into the headlines.  A showman, certainly, but also a very astute businessman who recognises that the key to growing the business is to deliver more of what passengers want.  As an example, Ryanair's latest generation of 737 planes give passengers more legroom and a brighter cabin.  Ryanair's self-service check-in machines at airports cut queues.  The Ryanair website is now much easier to use.  The Ryanair smartphone app means we don't have to print out boarding passes.  No wonder the passenger numbers continue to grow.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2018, 17:42:55 pm »
We fly approx 12 times a year 6 over 6 back for the past 15 years mostly Ryanair a few times aer Lingus. Once Monarch from Dublin re budget travel. Robbed on the euro conversion for in cabin purchases. Twice with TC from Belfast.
The only time we were delayed was about eight years ago when a passenger took I’ll  passed away over Portugal and Ryanair landed and this delayed their arrival in Fuerteventura to get us home.
As I said earlier no airline wants delays so unless there’s pure messing it won’t happen.
 I was speaking to an Eazyjet captain lately and he told me most delays are caused by drunken passengers heading out on stags.

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #18 on: August 23, 2018, 18:07:07 pm »
Let me put it this way, if a flights cancelled its for a reason and its normally something to do with safety, let there be no traffic controllers bad weather or an issue with the plane.  Don't forget the sun could be shining where you leaving from and storms where your going. Also look a Gatwick's total failure last week, you cant blame the Airline for that. So if you were leaving Fuerteventura and heading home to Gatwick which is closed because of a computer breakdown and no time scale for the repair you will have a major problem and no point in blaming the Airline and they probably wont have much information either.       
Now I don't know about you people but in all those situations I would prefer to have my feet on the ground. 
Industrial action in an airline well most carriers have had their share at one time or another.
There were a lot of people left sitting on their butts all over Europe when various airlines went belly up over the last number of years, one of the most recent was a favourite with the posters on here, Monarch. Now who's next I wonder but I bet its not Ryanair or EazyJet.     

Whats Gatwick got to do with the issue? Just you bringing it back to an issue which you are fixated on. The issue at Gatwick would have affected all the airlines who were using the airport, so all would be affected equally. So in your scenario all passengers with no respect who the carrier was.

I used the same thought process and kept my ear to reports and visited pilot forums with regards to Monarch and kept away from them a long time before they went belly up.

The business model for Ryan air is to stack them high and sell them cheap, passengers when they first started didn`t care about anything else except price. As the market has matured other companies have adopted the same model such as Whizz, Norwegian etc. RA fly to 37 countries out of 50 in Europe there are 195 countries in the world. So when you said Europe and beyond, I thought you were talking Startrek speak and RA were going into space, as they certainly not beyond Europe even as they have another 13 countries to conquer. Plus long haul if they were to go head to head with scheduled airlines where passengers expect higher standards no sure RA ethos could cope with the big changes required.

The logical step would to go international to get expansion and keep up growth, RA backed off from doing this. So they need to keep their workforce on the same conditions or go up market and raise the cost of flights. They are in catch 22 at the moment unless they change their model. So during this period of transition they are vulnerable now their workforce is unionised to more strike action. People will lose faith in the RA model if they get a cheap ticket, but planes keep getting cancelled not for action caused outside of the airlines hands but from disputes between RA and their own workforce.

I hope RA can square this circle, as for me they are bus service when I use them. Get on plane spend nothing on board, only take hand baggage, get off the other end. I expect no help when there are delays caused by things out of their control, as the ticket is so cheap. However, at the moment for me as I said too much of a possiblerisk of cancelled flight. I don`t think I will be alone if the situation escalates.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #19 on: August 23, 2018, 18:17:03 pm »
Is Israel in Europe ? Is Morocco in Europe?  Please try to get the odd fact right.  And yes Gatwick’s problems affected all airlines on the day. Where are the 37 in the European Union maybe your including a few principalities.? What else do we expect from Captain Kirk.
« Last Edit: August 23, 2018, 18:22:37 pm by dagwood »

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #20 on: August 23, 2018, 18:27:32 pm »
Is Israel in Europe ? Is Morocco in Europe?  Please try to get the odd fact right.  And yes Gatwick’s problems affected all airlines on the day. Where are the 37 in the European Union maybe your including a few principalities.? What else do we expect from Captain Kirk.

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/useful-info/about-ryanair/about-us

Based the fact on information from RA site above. Not like RA to not let customers know what is going on.

Glad they are spreading their wings looks good for Xmas in Bethlehem for you then this year then a "date" in Morocco.

Still leaves 193 countries for them to aim for.



Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #21 on: August 23, 2018, 18:36:52 pm »

 How many countries are in Europe?
Well geographically Europe consists out of 49 countries which are located entirely or partially in Europe. But an other 2 or 3 (Armenia and Cyprus and arguably Greenland) are considered European for cultural/historical reasons. Also some people include Israel as a European country instead of an Asian country. Which makes it at least 51 countries actually.

List of countries in Europe

On top of that there are some countries that are not necessarily recognized by all parties, like Transnistria, South Ossetia, Abkhazia, Artsakh and Northern Cyprus.

And of these at least 51 countries, but possibly up to 58 countries, there are 28 countries that currently form the EU.

List of countries in the European Union

19 countries in the EU use the Euro as currency.

26 countries are in the Schengen Agreement (some are not EU countries like Iceland or Norway)

Also I read the other day that there are 109–115 native languages spoken in the European countries. Which sounds about right, considering the heterogenous culture in Europe.

Languages of Europe

Originally Answered: How many countries are there in Europe?
As of right now I believe there are 47 countries in Europe.

But it all comes down to “your” definition of a country.

Europe:

Albania, Andorra, Belgium, Bosnia-Herzegovina, Bulgaria, Estonia, Denmark, Finland, France, Greece, Belarus, Ireland, Iceland, Italy, Kosovo, Croatia, Cyprus, Latvia, Lichtenstein, Lithuania, Luxembourg, Republic of Macedonia, Malta, Moldova, Monaco, Montenegro, Netherlands, Norway, Poland, Portugal, Romania, Russia, San Marino, Serbia, Slovakia, Slovenia, Spain, Great Britain, Switzerland, Sweden, Czech Republic, Turkey(?), Germany, Ukraine, Hungary, Vatican, Austria

Russia: A large majority of the population lives in Europe (around 115 million I think), but the largest land mass is in Asia. So I am quite convinced that Russians consider themselves European.

Turkey: This one is a lot more tricky.

So it all comes down your definition. UEFA has 55 national association members just to make it even more complicated :)
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Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #22 on: August 23, 2018, 18:51:34 pm »
Is Israel in Europe ? Is Morocco in Europe?  Please try to get the odd fact right.  And yes Gatwick’s problems affected all airlines on the day. Where are the 37 in the European Union maybe your including a few principalities.? What else do we expect from Captain Kirk.

https://www.ryanair.com/gb/en/useful-info/about-ryanair/about-us

Based the fact on information from RA site above. Not like RA to not let customers know what is going on.

Glad they are spreading their wings looks good for Xmas in Bethlehem for you then this year then a "date" in Morocco.

Still leaves 193 countries for them to aim for.



I hate to disappoint you but the U.K. has ceased to be the centre of the universe and Ryanair fly from other countries to places that are not on their U.K. schedules. 
On a different point I see Rudderless Ruddy Raab is advising Ulster business to look to the Irish government for advice on Brexit. Arleen will be pleased 😀.

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #23 on: August 23, 2018, 18:52:56 pm »
That`s too long for me to answer you need to be more concise (hoisted by your own petard).

https://www.whatarethe7continents.com/europe/many-countries-europe/

You pick on the pedantic stuff, do try to stick to the issue being discussed rather than going off on a tangent.

Anyway I`m off to enjoy the real world with real people to discuss things with, enjoy your keyboard.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #24 on: August 23, 2018, 19:07:01 pm »
You sir are a nasty unhappy piece of work who cannot be mistaken about anything. Your world would much brighter if the odd time you could say I must be mistaken.
I hope your day improves.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #25 on: August 23, 2018, 19:14:17 pm »
That`s too long for me to answer you need to be more concise (hoisted by your own petard).

https://www.whatarethe7continents.com/europe/many-countries-europe/

You pick on the pedantic stuff, do try to stick to the issue being discussed rather than going off on a tangent.

Anyway I`m off to enjoy the real world with real people to discuss things with, enjoy your keyboard.



Off to a lodge meeting then?

Offline beachlife

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #26 on: August 24, 2018, 00:14:49 am »
That`s too long for me to answer you need to be more concise (hoisted by your own petard).

https://www.whatarethe7continents.com/europe/many-countries-europe/

You pick on the pedantic stuff, do try to stick to the issue being discussed rather than going off on a tangent.

Anyway I`m off to enjoy the real world with real people to discuss things with, enjoy your keyboard.



Off to a lodge meeting then?

Yes just back from a nice social night and dance. I`m really can`t understand how you think you know me when we have never met. I don`t have any knowledge of you and its interesting that I don`t personalise my thoughts about you but you seem its important that you do. Last time I felt the need to do that was in junior school.

Why raise the issue of a lodge meeting as an Irish man you and I know the hidden messages in you raising that. You don`t know whether I kick with the right or left foot so lets not go down that route, I had hoped that Irish people had moved on from that but obviously some dinosaurs still  exist.

Interesting that you point out to me I never admit I`m wrong when I make a mistake. I have done that when someone asked me to play the man and not the country and I was happy to accept that I was doing that . However can you tell me when you have accepted you are wrong? Seems 1 rule for everyone else but different rules for you.

I have said before I am familiar with Irish men with your mentality (left & right footers) and know the close minds that both sides have.    I am guilty of not putting you in the camp of the closed minded Irish men I`m so familiar with but accept I am wrong and from what you have commented I certainly consider you as one now.  So there we go an apology from me for being mistaken.

Offline vivafuerte

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #27 on: August 24, 2018, 01:02:12 am »
dagwoods a nob end, every single person on here knows that (although he does have hundreds of accounts to try and make out he has support)

Offline vivafuerte

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #28 on: August 24, 2018, 01:08:28 am »
and the argument for pay and conditions ?

you sort that out before you work for the guy, im not supporting ryannair bullying its staff but if everyone thought a bit about the salary and the conditions before agreeing to work this situation wouldnt be happening.

im a employer and shouldnt be advising this but I honestly would advise you, dont work for someone unless you agree to the terms, and those terms can and WILL be changed for the right applicant.

your not just selling yourself out by accepting number two terms of employment, you are, without actually understanding, making number two terms of employment bad for everyone else.

Offline dagwood

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Re: Good news for people on Fuerteventura
« Reply #29 on: August 24, 2018, 07:50:07 am »
What are you on about Beachlife I don’t judge people by which lodge they belong to. Why even Homer Simpson attends and enjoys lodge meetings.